Brake change trauma...

[buze]

So, started to removed all four corners. Rear calipers were fine, apart that one of the brake copper line is /fixed/ to it's thread, so I can't rotate that part, I had to rotate the whole caliper to remove the flexi line from it, then uncrew the line from the copper thread... i have no idea how I'm going to reattach it!

Then on the front caliper, same thing, if I twist the 11mm head, the copper twists as well! It can't be good! :/ So I did the same; turned the whole caliper until it's detached from it's line, but here I can't even unscrew the line...

Oh, and the two caliper brackets 16mm bolts were *solid* I had to use the breaker bar -- however, the one bracket at the front is *also* solid, and I have no room whatsoever to put a breaker bar, so again, I have no idea how I'm going to proceed.. I dosed it in WD40, and 'hope' it works tomorrow :/

So overall, not terribly successful !

 

[hard top]

@t-tony ?

 

[t-tony]

Those copper pipes will need to be replaced. Which bolt is it that you cannot undo? Cut the copper pipe off RIGHT NEXT TO the union then they will out screw easily. The problem is the steel and copper react to each other and stick. I always oil the pipe before sliding the union up to screw in.
If you can't make pipes up yourself attach the unions to the pipes concerned and post them to me. I'll make you some up.

Tony.

 

[motco]

Am I correct in assuming that you are doing more than just pads? I am about to change pads in mine but don't anticipate breaking any hydraulic unions in the process.

 

[Nodzed]

Am I correct in assuming that you are doing more than just pads? I am about to change pads in mine but don't anticipate breaking any hydraulic unions in the process.

If you are doing just pads, agree there is no need to undo any brake lines.

 

[5harp3y]

hit the 16mm with a hammer to shock them and then go back at them with the biggest ratchet you can fit in there

 

[Nodzed]

hit the 16mm with a hammer to shock them and then go back at them with the biggest ratchet you can fit in there

Yeh thats it, don't mess about use the biggest thing in the tool box! @5harp3y you're an animal

 

[Lee]

hit the 16mm with a hammer to shock them and then go back at them with the biggest ratchet you can fit in there

Brake lines not carrier bolts

 

[motco]

If you are doing just pads, agree there is no need to undo any brake lines.

Thanks Nodzed, I thought I was growing senile for a moment!

 

[5harp3y]

Yeh thats it, don't mess about use the biggest thing in the tool box! @5harp3y you're an animal

He also mentioned the 16mm carrier bolts

 

[5harp3y]

Brake lines not carrier bolts

Read the op again, he also mentions the caliper carriers

 

[5harp3y]

Another top tip is to get yourself some proper flare spanners for brake lines

 

[Sean d]

If you are just replacing the pads there is no need to remove the carriers, just remove the 2 slider bolts 6mm allen key I think, but I suppose you are planning on doing more work

 

[mrscalex]

I can get a 24" breaker bar on any bolt on the suspension/brakes and I'm definitely not a magician So I suspect you may not be thinking quite laterally enough. Have you tried turning the steering, jacking the car up higher or going at it from the other side of the bolt?

I'm not 100% sure what work you're doing to your brakes. But you might have to accept if you change the flexi hoses that you are going to destroy the rigid lines in the process. If they are the original rigid lines then you will be doing yourself a favour anyway as they all cause an MOT fail at some point in their life - many already!

If the rigid lines are going to get replaced then best thing as I think Tony mentioned is to cut them off at the union and get a proper 6-sided socket on them while carefully counter-holding the flex-line with grips.

You'll also need to counter-hold when tightening back up. But this time you'll have to use a proper flare spanner to do the rigid pipes up. They need to be quite tight to seal properly but don't over do it.

 

[buze]

I'm changing the discs&pads, the refurbing all calipers, installing new lines, and flushing the system. I thought that was enough already! Now I realise I can't finish the job, and need to spec for also changing the copper lines, without the right tools :/ The car had the brakes lines replaced in the past, it's in the MOT reports -- they don't look too bad really.

When you mention "at the union" what do you *mean* by that? Union of what with what? Is the union the steel part that has the bolt+threads?

I'll try turning the wheels and see if that opens and angle for the breaker bar...

 

[mrscalex]

I'm changing the discs&pads, the refurbing all calipers, installing new lines, and flushing the system. I thought that was enough already! Now I realise I can't finish the job, and need to spec for also changing the copper lines, without the right tools :/ The car had the brakes lines replaced in the past, it's in the MOT reports -- they don't look too bad really.

When you mention "at the union" what do you *mean* by that? Union of what with what? Is the union the steel part that has the bolt+threads?

I'll try turning the wheels and see if that opens and angle for the breaker bar...

The join between the flexi-hose and rigid line - like in your first picture. If the rigid lines are recent and you can take the joint apart and WITHOUT distortion, ie twisting the rigid line then you can re-use it. If you twist/distort the copper line taking it apart you need to change it unless you like playing Russian Roulette. It looks to me like it's already distorted in that picture but I might be wrong. These unions more often than not can't be taken apart without the copper twisting.

Should you make the decision to scrap the rigid line then that's where the chop it off at the union and get a proper socket on it comes from.

Rigid lines are cheap. I paid £6.50 ea to have mine supplied and made up with unions off ebay seller bigbadnev. I ordered 910mm (900mm would have been slightly better as I got it shaped closely to factory bends and never expected to be able to) for the rear lines on my facelift 2.2. Or take Tony up on his offer. They are not that difficult to fit, just be methodical in bending them up if you like to see it all go back neat and tidy. The more difficult part of all this I would say is bleeding the brakes if it's your first time. But you are in for that already. Read up the recent threads. And preferably get yourself a pressure bleeder.

The perception of rigid lines being expensive to change comes from the labour rate at most garages!

 

[Sp02zbr]

I had to change flexi hoses. Brake lines etc as they just broke.

As said. Cheap parts

 

[buze]

@mescalex thanks for that. Would you also know the length for the *front* lines? if I do that job, might as well do it all around really...

I'm ordering a set of these. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Yato-YT-01...&qid=1534962691&sr=8-3&keywords=flare+spanner

Do you need any special tools to bend the pipe, or just patience and a set of various 'round' items to bend over? I'm OK in the patience department, what I'm not good at is the brute force+ignorance approach, that usually paralyses me

Oh, since I have you guys there, what do you call these 10mm 'flat' screws that hold the arch lining to the chassis? I noticed on one side there is *one* screw holding the whole thing!

 

[mrscalex]

I found a deep socket that fitted the existing bend radius. I made the first bend. Just gentle coaxing - it bends easily.

Then, I think crucially, I made the decision to cable tie the 2 pieces together as I went. Next bend, cable tie etc. I got a nice copy of the original like that.

No idea on front length. You’ll have to measure adding the length of the part of the unions you can’t see.

I’ll try and find a link to the arch liner screws I use. But they aren’t quite the same size as the originals. It’s barely any more expensive to buy from the dealer.

 

[buze]

So @mrscalex, should I just bite the bullet, and buy some pipe, a flaring kit, and small pipe cutter and actually redo them all? I don't mind as long as it's a 'scoped' job, ie I don't discover there's 2 other jobs that I'm going to discover while doing that one Or is that pipe flaring actually a very skilled job I shouldn't trust myself with?

Pipe + unions:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Copper-B...533327?hash=item1edc54558f:g:xkEAAOSwqu1auOjM
And copper flaring tools: https://www.amazon.co.uk/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias=diy&field-keywords=copper+flaring

This time I'd rather spend a little bit more, and get reasonable quality kit. Worth case scenario I'd perma-lend it to the #zedshed afterward...

Have you guys considered passing the copper tube in heatshrink tubing, and heating the tube once installed? It would make a very nice insulation and protect from corrosion. heck, i'd heatshrink the whole 'union' thing as well for next time it needs to be removed!