Fair or unjust

[Toby]

Not sure if this has been seen or not here - watched it last night then an numbe rof times this morning.
Not too sure but think justice was a bit harsh.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnQdwsA960w


Charged with driving without due care and attention - hefty fine ( £1000 + costs ) and 5 points.
This was before the new highway rules came into force too.

My take on it - he pulled as far left as he could without driving on the grass verge, he didnt appear to be excessive speeding. But apparently he was expected to stop to let them pass ( remember this was before new hichway code changes ) He doesnt touch her at all

The lady on the bike was free wheeling, you can see she doesnt pedal at all, and is following the person in front and so cant sped up. She is using ccycle shoes clipped in
and probably cant get her feer out easily, due to the slow speed topples over. I'm of the opinion if you arent competent using cleats, dont. They can be a danger hazard.

It could have been handled better but I feel the punishment too harsh and he is being made an example., and why wsnt the rear cyclist fined for abusive behavour too ?

 

[AleNod]

I am a bit with you on this @Toby , I think an example has been made - welcome to the new normal.

The car does seem to just barrel along. Would I have slowed down - yes. Would I have come to a stop - close to, but probably not. So sooner or later I'm going to be in trouble then too. Like you say, the poor lass has to basically stop because of the cyclist in front of her, and she doesn't seem able to twist her shoes off the pedals and then topples over.

And another thing. According to the (now) strict letter of the law, what is the poor car driver supposed to do ? So I come to an actual stop, I'm not putting my car on that grass verge because its narrow and immediately adjacent a ditch so I'm just not doing that. But now there isn't 1.5 meters gap for the cyclist to pass. Do I yell out the window to ask then to also stop and stand on the verge so I can pass them safely ? (If its for eg a farmers milk collection truck they would have to). If the cyclists try and pass me at less than 1.5m am I supposed to open my car door and prevent them until they comply with the legal minimum ? Or what ?

Like you say, I think an example has been made . . .

 

[Mike Fishwick]

The Landrover may have been travelling a little quickly, but had left lots of room for the cyclists - what the sceams and panic were about I cannot imagine, but this is an example of cyclist power, even if the real cause was incompetence on the part of the cyclist.

 

[Z Victor 1]

No, that is typical of an arrogant idiot who doesn't care about other road users. The driver should have slowed down, I know I would. Being a cyclist as well as a petrol head I appreciate how vulnerable cyclists( also horse riders) are, but drivers like this one take no account of others. The same types that always expect the other driver to pull in etc, etc. Of course on a narrow lane the 1.5 metre rule does not, cannot, apply. Common sense and courtesy is all that's required.

 

[abh29]

I am always very careful in passing any horse , and I'm yet to encounter a horse rider who is not courtesy , but I am afraid I encounter a minority of cyclists who just arrogant. I also completely fail to understand the reluctance of some cyclists to be seen,dressed head to toe in black on dark wooded country roads. I also wonder why the need to ride in the centre of the road ,when a bike lane is running adjacent,according to my son its a much smoother ride on the cycle track. He is a keen cyclist goes from extreme bikes ,on the road its battery power then off road a mountain bike (that seems worth more than my Z3---a lot more)

 

[Z Victor 1]

There are idiots on bikes as well as in cars and being a cyclist I just don't understand the current fashion amongst many cyclists for wearing black gear from head to toe while riding a matt black bike.They must have a death wish. When riding against a dark background they just become invisible to other rode users.

 

[t-tony]

I would say it was 50 - 50. The prat in the Land Rover should have slowed right down, no reason not to. Woman on bike using something that stops you getting you foot down when needed quickly is an idiot using them on the road. They’re for track use. When I was an old boy someone gave some “rat traps” and I put them on my pedals but after a similar incident I ditched them.

Tony.

 

[Z Victor 1]

Nothing wrong with clip pedals Tony, I've used them for years. You have to anticipate potential problems and unclip in readiness. Narrow lane a vehicle is coming, unclip just in case you've got to stop. Just like thinking ahead when driving.Incidentally, if I'm on a narrow lane and I hear or see a car coming I always stop to let them pass for my own safety. Most drivers slown down and acknowledge that, but drivers like the one on the video just drive without any concern for anybody else.

 

[t-tony]

You can say the same about the cyclists Ken.

Tony.

 

[miller1098]

I drive single track road every day and we hav cyclists walkers and horses I always stop or drive very slowly “it may be the only time I do”but I’ve done all of the other things and you are many more times more vulnerable than the vehicle driver and as such the driver however annoyed or late they are should give way . If the land rover had stopped or slowed would the cyclist have fallen? If they had he could have had such a laugh about it . But to my mind they had no consideration for anyone but themselves.

 

[Mark Gutteridge]

Driver should have slowed down.

 

[Z Victor 1]

Like I said before, 'common sense and courtesy'. It doesn't cost anything whether in a car on a bike or what.

 

[Toby]

I'm more with Tony 50 /50 with regards to her falling,due to her and her friend in front, and in total agreement he should have slowed more, possibly even stopped.
I was really making the point that I didnt think the penalty was fair in this instance - total costs were £1200+ and 5 points.

I know of one cyclist who openly admits he rides through red lights rather than stopping so he doesnt have to uncleat his shoes. He justifies it as its safer than trying to get his shoe recleated.

 

[Mike Fishwick]

There was about two feet between the cyclist and the Landrover, and about a foot to the curb. The leading rider did not have any problems, so what was the panic about? Yes, a more prudent driver would have slowed down a lot, and maybe pulled over, but this still looks like a panic attack from the cyclist. Any cyclist who panics like that should not really be on the road for their own safety.

 

[Z Victor 1]

Any cyclist who rides through red lights wants locking up for their own safety!

 

[miller1098]

I'm more with Tony 50 /50 with regards to her falling,due to her and her friend in front, and in total agreement he should have slowed more, possibly even stopped.
I was really making the point that I didnt think the penalty was fair in this instance - total costs were £1200+ and 5 points.

I know of one cyclist who openly admits he rides through red lights rather than stopping so he doesnt have to uncleat his shoes. He justifies it as its safer than trying to get his shoe recleated.

I’ve ridden with cleats for the last 40 years on the road and on a mountain bike there’s no big deal about it your shoes flick out easily you can adjust the tension if your on a track but they are easy to use .the front rider must of been intimated by the land rover to have to slow down so much.i see no blame on the bike riders . I’m afraid it needs heavier fines and penalties to make people take notice to save lives

 

[Z Victor 1]

Out on my old Moser last week, clip in pedals, of course.

 

[Mike Fishwick]

Yes, but if the leading rider had to slow down sharply, WHY was the other rider following so closely that she could not also slow down? Very normal people tend to think that when they are two wheels they should follow closely - as in the Tour de France etc. If she had followed the old Highway Code, and kept a decent distance, things would have been different, but you have to consider the Group Riding (or driving) Syndrome, where people seem afraid to seperate from their leader . . . maybe they do not know where they are going! In this case the rear rider had certainly failed to keep a prudent distance.

Of course, the new Highway Code reccommends that cyclists ride two abreast, for some obscure safety-related reason. In addition to the well-publicised 'Priority' principle, the new Highway Code should tell drivers to treat cyclists in the same manner as animals, keeping well clear of them, and expecting any odd kind of behaviour. I do not hate cyclists, but am always annoyed by the way they all seem to abdicate responsibility for the own safety to others - after about sixty years of riding large motorcycles, I would not have the courage/stupidity to ride that that!

 

[miller1098]

Lol The distance between the the riders makes no difference to the speed of the landrover and he was obviously going to fast,end of story. And for the generalization that all cyclysts abdicate responsibility thats just a lod of bull crap

 

[Nodzed]

I bike and drive, I also use clips, her clips were obviously too tight, she needs to learn how to setup & use her equipment correctly and safely.
As for the driver, he is a complete knob and should have slowed down to a sensible speed, but stop? why should he there was room, he didn't cause her to fall off, her incompetence did that and what's stopping the cyclists from stopping they had plenty of time to react?

Please don't go spouting the new laws at me either because I'm well aware of them, if I'm on my bike I put my safety and common sense over and above the law and don't ignore the fact I will come off worse in a collision regardless of what the HWC says .

Everyone needs to be sensible on the roads including cyclists.